Can the Sun Keep You Cool?

His technology acheives 5.4% thermal efficency, solar cells are between 12-20% efficency. The benefit of his technology is that it is cheap, but how much cheaper than than crappy solar cells which are 6% efficent?

Interesting setup but the concept isn't entirely new. Kerosene and gas fridges have been around for years. It's rather strange to think of fire keeping your food cold.

I personly think the idea deserves some merrit. With energy bills rising the way they are, I dont think we should dismiss any addition to the consumers money saving arsenal. I don't see truely self sustaining homes being able to survive on only one sorce of engery. Solar energy both light and thermal are free so why not employ both. My only worry is that their end product could wined up alot bulkier then the average consumer is willing to put up with. And from what I could see from the pictures posted that might not be the case.

Dear Folks:

This is the biggest break through in AC I've seen. 1/3 costs, My only question is if there is a maintainence issue with the build up of deposits of any sorts in the channels due to poor water quality.

http://www.coolerado.com/NewsAndNotable/DelphiIdalexCoolerado.htm

while there may be maintainence needed i dont think that one should be a problem since it doesnt use watter but a "synthetic fluid with a very low boiling point"

matteran's solution is interesting but
I don't know if you have heard about this company. Hydrogen Technologies Applications, Inc. of Clearwater Florida that has invented a gas generating machine that converts distilled water into a gas they call Aquygen (HHO). Its being used right now for heating, welding & transportation. The generator operates for less than $1.00 per hour. Uses approximately. 5 kilowatts & a quart of water while producing approximately. 1500 liters of Aquygen per hour. This is a new commercial form of hydrogen technology thats ready now & much cheaper & power full then fuel cell tech. Did I mention they also use the gas in their autos an get 50% better MPG. Their web site is www.hytechapps.com phone 727-531-5979 The machines are built and ready for sale NOW. According to physicist Ruggero Maria Santilli in an article published Available online at www.sciencedirect.com HE2131. It's A new gaseous and combustible form of water. You should really be interested in this one

sjdee1@earthlink.net

To the above commenter:

I have heard of this HHO, or "Aguygen" it is commonly referred to as Dihydrogen Monoxide. I dont think many people understand the ramifications of the use of such a dangerous chemical, and the proliferation and continued use of Dihydrogen Monoxide as a power source is just beyond belief to me. What some people will do to make a buck.

Just look at the assosciated health risks and environmental damage that Dihydrogen Monoxide or "Aguygen" is attributed to:

*Prolonged exposure to solid DHMO causes severe tissue damage.
*Death due to accidental inhalation of DHMO, even in small quantities.
*Excessive ingestion produces a number of unpleasant though not typically life-threatening side-effects.
*DHMO is a major component of acid rain.
*Gaseous DHMO can cause severe burns.
*Contributes to soil erosion.
*Leads to corrosion and oxidation of many metals.
*Contamination of electrical systems often causes short-circuits.
*Exposure decreases effectiveness of automobile brakes.
*Found in biopsies of pre-cancerous tumors and lesions.
*Often associated with killer cyclones in the U.S. Midwest and elsewhere.
*Thermal variations in DHMO are a suspected contributor to the El Nino weather effect.

There is an excellent web resource aimed at educating the public to Dihydrogen monoxide and its dangers can be found at http://www.dhmo.org/

Someone should do something about this...

The previous poster Sal to be mildy blunt is a moron. That is a spoof site setup by a university professor studying the naivety of people and what it takes to convince typically rational people to believe almost anything. The substance that dhmo.org is referring to is WATER... People please don't blindly accept things as true, that is what got this current president elected.

From looking at the animation, it seems like it would require wasting lots of external "cooling water" (which obviously has to be cool enough to be cooler than the boiling point of this fluid anyway), which is in short supply on hot days. Has anyone taken the cost of this into consideration?

P.S. and if you're going to do that, then why not just use this "cooling water" to cool down your house?

I think "Kosta" is using said spoof site to insinuate that the above poster "Sai" and his grand technology is a moron in proposing that HHO is any different than water.

HHO=H2O=Dihydrogen Monoxide...

think harder, and don't blindly accept things as true.

actually, everything the 'spoof' site says is true. Every single point listed in Sal's post, absolutely true.

*Prolonged exposure to solid DHMO causes severe tissue damage.

Frostbite is fun for the whole family!

*Death due to accidental inhalation of DHMO, even in small quantities.

Nobody's ever drowned from inhaling water, that's crazy talk.

*Excessive ingestion produces a number of unpleasant though not typically life-threatening side-effects.

Well, what if I have to dodge some crazy pitbull or something on the way to the can?

*DHMO is a major component of acid rain.

Water in rain? Really? Interesting...

*Gaseous DHMO can cause severe burns.

Steam can burn you? Sounds fishy...

*Contributes to soil erosion.

duh, Grand Canyon anyone?

*Leads to corrosion and oxidation of many metals.

what?!? Metal rusting from exposure to water?!? Insane.

*Contamination of electrical systems often causes short-circuits.

No way man, I always take a bath with my toaster, keeps the water warm.

*Exposure decreases effectiveness of automobile brakes.

Unless you buy some of those fancy unskiddable tires!

ok, now even I'm bored with this post...but, fact remains, all that stuff is most certainly true about water. So, quit saying it isn't, cuz it is, heh.

Don't write off the HHO concept. The website ( hytechapps ) is a bit hokey and for some reason they want to obfuscate what is going on ... but it's real... to a point. Supposedly this guy has invented an efficient method of electrolysis. What he does is split off the h2 from the O ( or rather 2 molecules of H2 and 1 O2 ) and then immediately ignite them... get it?
The problem with the concept is that you have to generate this on the fly, or you will end up with the problem of having to have storage for all the O2 and H2 you produce... which is far too volumeous to be stored in a car in gas form if you seperate them, and I don't need to tell you how dangerous it is if you don't seperate them.

Generating hydrogen and oxygen via the electrolysis of water doesn't produce net energy. Period. The energy going in as electricity just comes back out as combustable hydrogen and oxygen.
Conservation of Energy: It's not just a good idea, it's the law.

Uh... First law of Thermodynamics? If you need to produce H2 and O2 from H2O, the energy required to split the two would be equal to or less than the energy acquired from combining the two in combustion.
(Damn, Grant got to it before I did!)

My faith in the readership is falling fast.. is science no longer required in school? I gotta admit the "dihydrogen" bit was funny though. One inaccuracy however is that water doesn't cause electrical shorts; dissolved minerals in the water do. Electric stuff works fine in pure water.

I think you missed the point, Grant - the generation of H2 + H2 + O2 time-shifts the collection of energy. You can spend 24 hours building up the gas, and then use it when you need it.

It's not like the whole fossil fuel cycle doesn't have energy loss, either ...

The *real* problem between Brown's Gas is that storing is safely isn't easy. Hydrogen gas tunnels through tiny gaps that nothing else can pass through, and burns with this nearly invisible blue flame.

Remember, hydrogen as used isn't a fuel source, it's really acting as a battery.

A normal battery (AA, AAA, D, C) takes approximately 2,000 units of energy to produce for every unit of energy you get back.

And batteries are terrible for the environment, and terribly inefficient.

So if a little browns gas is easy to produce, not really stored because it's generated on demand, and quite efficient (certainly more than .05% with batteries), then I'm all for it.

Im not an expert, but I know a little about thermodynamics and... this just doesn't feel right somehow. Can we get someone qualified and unbiased to just check this thingie is even possible, not in the relm of the perpetual-motion machine?

Mabye possible prototypes that can benefit humanity should be shrouded from the public until their release. What do we know? Oh yeah, and I think that the "perpetual motion" machine is scientifically impossible...anyone agree with me here?

I looked for anyone using the welder to see what they think- whether they like it or don't like it, but wasn't able to find anyone as of a few months ago. I only find people like me speculating this way or that way, or trying to find out what is the deal with this.

In my heart, I feel that there is a way to split water efficiently, but we'll see if this is it.

The law of conservation of energy applies to closed systems, kids. A car is most certainly not a closed system.

The universe is a closed system. :-)

"One inaccuracy however is that water doesn't cause electrical shorts; dissolved minerals in the water do. Electric stuff works fine in pure water."

Actually even pure water will dissocate into H+ and OH-, which means it will conduct electricity, abeit poorly because the dissocation amount is fairly small.

Hytechapps might be serious, but they're
possibly (I'm an engineer not a lawyer)
at the least OBSFUCATING what they're doing.

Electrolyse (distilled) water and all you'll
get in Hydrogen and Oxygen.

That's it. There isn't some miraculous other
gas that you can get from that.

And - TANSTAAFL. Thermodynamics wins the
day over the... I won't use the word "Cranks"
or "Nutcases" or anything other that might
be considered Libel (or similar).

Hydrogen - Novel? No... Suitable additive for
(quote) ANY STANDARD FUEL (/quote).
Definitely NOT.

What worries me more is that the company
is based in Clearwater, FL.

Chris

/Actually a rocket scientist

Conservation of energy can still be preserved, it just means his system is more efficient at gleaning energy from the car's engine then the drivetrain is. Seems unlikely but not impossible.

Has anyone looked up DHMO on Wikipedia yet?????

Re: Hytechapps

The main problem with saying "more efficient"
or similar things is: What Is It That You
Are Referring To?

Hydrogen is a really nice energy source.
Kind of. It's not particularly dense, even
when liquified (think about the Space Shuttle
main tank)...

BUT - you have to crack the Water (/DHMO/etc
for those with a Sense Of Humour)
to get the Hydrogen - and that requires
energy. You have to supply energy to
electrolyse the water, you have to use
energy to compress/liquify the Hydrogen -
which will be less than the energy you get
back from burning it.

Another point is that a gas mix of Hydrogen/
Oxygen isn't the safest thing to have sitting
in a gas tank. Never mind that Oxygen is
corrosive, but given that the H2/O2 reaction
to form water is exothermic, it doesn't take
much for it to happen - either by combustion
or detonation.

Back to the point of the article...
Now - given this A/C system... well... I'd
want to see some unbiased engineering
analysis of it first.
My primary thought is that having the heat
is one thing, but you have to dump the
energy somewhere... That is, yes you
can use solar heating to generate power,
but you generally have to provide a
temperature differential in order to extract
work...

Matteran's idea is pretty much a relatively efficient Sterling Engine. They use a series of valves and heat to replace the 'injector' pump on a traditional closed circuit turbine geration system. The difference here is that they are using a low boiling point liquid and ambient temps to recondense the liquid. Think of it this way, you have a black pipe in the sun that heats the liquid in it at least 50 degrees above the air temp even if the airtemp is 100 deg. Lets say that tube is on a reflector to make it even hotter. Then you just pipe the gas that you want to recondense through a pipe that is UNDER the reflector and has some fins on it. It cools down to ambient temps and is pumped back into the system using some gating valves and some more solar heat. Their website has animations that explain it quite well. The idea is not a huge amount of energy all at once but a steady flow. It's like parallel computing, you want lots of small units in parallel rather than just one big one. Fossil fuels and Biodiesel are both just ways of converting sunlight into energy and those cycles are far slower than this one.

OK, I should correct some of what I said above. The term is Stirling engine, not Sterling Engine. And this is not a Stirling engine. Maybe more of a 'Stirling Turbine'? Either way I love the idea. The only thing that make my BS meter blip (just a TINY bit) is that the name is Matteran Energy but if you look at the website name matteranenergy... 'Matter, an energy'? or 'Matter and energy'? I know everybody likes to be clever with their startup company names but... and the contact's name is Jeff Sterling. Sterling, Stirling.... que Twilight Zone background music... Like I said, if it can replace buring things to make electricity I'm all for it.
As to what Chris posted above:"My primary thought is that having the heat
is one thing, but you have to dump the
energy somewhere... That is, yes you
can use solar heating to generate power,
but you generally have to provide a
temperature differential in order to extract
work..." the differential is there, ambient air temp versus temp of liquid in a black tube with a reflector in the direct sun. They are just monkeying with a different boinling point than water and a different expansion rate than water to steam.

The real problem is that the guy who wrote the article is forgetting that a generator like that relies on a temperature gradient being available. Another poster before this brought up the excellent point that if you have a source of cooler temperature than the ambient temperature, why aren't you simply using that to cool your place? That would cut out the middle man and improve efficiency.

The real practical application of this would not be heating or cooling, but rather generating a small amount of electricity to power devices.

First off, you can find the Aquygen patent online at freepatentsonline.com advance search for Klein Dennis. Basically its a hydrolysis machine. And if you go to the site, they are just injecting H2 and O2 from an auto-based electrolysis mmachine - no big deal and certainly not a big advance - just a lot of hype from a dumb Fox reporter (that's redundant). It they injected N2 (nitrogen, an inert gas), they would get some boost as well. Certainly doesn't look economical based on total system costs.

As for the Colorado coolers, the trick is that they are getting more cooling (thermal transfer) than standards swamp coolers. Sure, it uses water instead of electricity - but if water is available and cheap, and the humidity in your area isn't normally high, it may be cheaper than standard heap pumps.

As for minerals left after the eval - a real problem - note that the evaporator core is both cheap and replaceable. Still, it is a weakness of the system.

As for hydrogen's monoxide (literally, 2 hydrogen atoms and one oxygen atom) more commonly known as H20 - its an old freshman high school chemistry joke. ITs possible that we might find ways to make hydrogen cheaper - algae or physical chemistry tricks - there are lots of problems with the system that make it unlikely to be a viable technology in the near term (despite what president that thought science was too much hard work). It needs more research but current claims that H2 if viable and economical are for suckers.

Totaly agree Gnomic, except the last part on the prospects for H2.

These are my favorites:

Solar H2: http://www.hydrogensolar.com/index.html

Bio H2: http://www.nanologix.net/

Sorry to post about a subject other than the original article but there have been too many people on here running their mouth without even reading anything. In regards to AGUYGEN, it is not the Brown version of electrolysis. They say that many times in the descriptions. If you read the technical papers you get even more information. It doesn't split the water to H2 and O. What they did, roughly, is change the polarity of one of the hydrogen atoms in PURE water. It changes the chemical bond so that what was H-O-H is now (HxH)-O. They invented a new kind of chemical bond that turned water to a supergas at room temperature and gave it a different weight and mass, which gave it new properties. The gas bonds and reacts with solids, liquids and other gasses. This is not some simple electrolysis. It is almost like quantum chemistry.

The beautiful thing here is that this crew duped a local news crew into putting them on the 6 O'clock news!

Martin Tibbitts

yea , what the fuck is the democratic societies within the world going to do about the up coming oil crisis?

This shit is really going to happen within five years.

The Middle east is going to be all fucked up and people are going to die, because they wont have gas to drive to the supermarket and buy food.

Supermarkets wont be able to get food to the stores because there will be no gas to power semi-trucks.

Global warming is melting ice caps faster than your momma on crack. Florida will be under water in 50 years. This will be worse than Katrina.

This world has some nasty disasters coming very soon. Including the great earthquakes that are due for the coastal regions of California. Massive fires and death tolls will arise from a 8.0 quake that is expected to occur within 15 years.

Everything that I am telling my audience is factual.

The last major earthquake to hit San Fransico was in 1906 and it was the type of quake that averages out to occur every 100 years.

Humans have developed urban areas in placed that will be destroyed within a 100 years.

Seattle Washington is built right next to Mount Rieneer. When that volcano blows its top, the city will be destroyed without warning. The whole climate of the NorthWest will be fucked. Also, when Yellowstone's super volcano blows up, the whole United States will be able to see the dust cloud from that shit.

Basically I'm informing the world that some serious shit is going to happen in our lifetime and we should be expecting it to happen.

Ignore the mass media deception and rhedoric. Mass media is out to make a profit and only gives news that the people want to hear and see. African genocide is happening everyday and the mass media does not report it. Why? Because Americans don't want to hear the bullshit.

More people are dying in Africa today than people in the Holocaust. Fuck the American free media asshole shit fucks.

The United States needs to stop supporting retarded countries like Isreal and giving money to fake democracies.

Other democracies should not be playing the world police and killing innocent civilians. We need to be preaching peace on Earth and people need to smoke marijuana and listen to Bob Marley. This will be the ultimate solution for the peaceful end to all war.

Thats all I got to say, GO MIAMI HEAT!!!

Eric Knight wrote: "It changes the chemical bond so that what was H-O-H is now (HxH)-O."

Now it has been a while since I took chemistry in either HS or College, BUT I think the above mentioned combination (H-H-O) would be a little hard to achieve since Hydrogen only has one electron with which to form covalent bonds with. This is why H2O forms as H-O-H.

martin tibbits just stated everything ive been telling people for the past year. thank you

I don't think anyone has mentioned Matterand Energy's low temperature power cycle's biggest advantage. Low temperature heat is available almost everywhere cheaper than any other form of energy.

Hmm... Looks to me like this could work with just distilled water, but to make the boiling point real low the whole circuit would need to operate at less than atmospheric pressure. Any "vacuum" leaks to the outside and the cycle would break down as the boiling point raises. (Dunno if that'd be the case with any other "special" working medium. Alcohol?) The other thing it relys upon is the operation of the valves at the right setpoints. (Looks simple enough from anyone dealing with a plant or HVAC operation.) The one other part that's not too clear is the cool end of the thermal cycle. It'd probably require a second constant flow with a radiator or a ground cooling coil. (Which would require a pump and possibly a fan.) The question is whether or not the differential pressure across the turbine produces significantly more power than what's used to drive the cooling fan and or pump.

Could using electroysis produce those unique properties by submitting differing Fourier Series of waves to change chemical bonds H-O-H into (HxH)-0 ? If that was the case, one can not patent old science, or can they?

When producing the gas through electrolysis, it's easier to add a bit of Potassium Carbonate (K2CO3?).

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Clean the air? It is possible. Clean water? It is possible too.
Clean energy? It is possible as well.
My idea is very difficult for understanding. It is not difficult for engineer - mechanic, who knows very good the Pascal's law and even-arm lever.
Please open GOOgle and find metozor and next :
index of metozor.
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Clean the air? It is possible. Clean water? It is possible too.
Clean energy? It is possible as well.
My idea is very difficult for understanding. It is not difficult for engineer - mechanic, who knows very good the Pascal's law and even-arm lever.
Please open GOOgle and find metozor and next :
index of metozor.
Overthere is all about idea of main .
example : http://www.nets.pl/~metozor/for_greenpeace.html or
http://www.nets.pl/~metozor/energy_for_everybody.html
http://www.nets.pl/~metozor/prolog_for_metoz.html
Email this article to friends.

This technology looks very interesting. I'm going to look into it and if it seems to perform well I may even promote it to my mailing list and consider investing in this company.

The conception of an energy is discreate one to the same as a imbecility. No one has seen the energy and no one has seen the imbecility. We are able to observe results of the energy and imbecility. At present we have got to few energy because we have got to much imbecility.
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Great concept. Good to see someone is putting it into practice. It's about time someone came up with a practical power concept. This is the best I've come across. But where are the big corporations? Is anybody sponsoring these guys?

Regarding the previous comment, I think you have to compare apples to apples to have a meaningful discussion about efficiency. He could just as easily compared the efficiency of a car motor to PV. It's meaningless. I agree with the other guy. The only thing that counts is COST. I want to see this low temperature thing get going, because the cost is right. And because it makes us independent. Great article.